Jump to content
The End of my Addiction

Recommended Posts

Ne1
5 hours ago, Molly78 said:

I agree blood testing is useful, I can't find any EVIDENCE that hair analysis will tell you what your allergies are -

I can't say specifically if she meant both worked for allergies or one or the other. I did practically quote her exact statement, however. 

Bottom line? There are very likely to be people who swear to it, and those who do not and we'll all just have to agree to disagree about it. A lot like diets...Which, for me, is a sore subject. And even supplements themselves, come to think of it. 

Though I did have a conversation with my pDoc about it this morning and she said she is learning a great deal about both nutrition and supplementation and is eager to share...But we didn't get into specifics. Too much else to talk about at the moment. I'll post what I take, and why, later...

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Ne1
17 hours ago, Felina said:

It freaks me out a little bit too, but only because I really like to eat. The reasoning behind it is completely sound in my opinion, and a lot of people swear by it. Elimination diets are a great way to figure out food allergies/sensitivities. I have this on my "To Do: Some Day" list, but I wonder if the "Some Day" will ever happen :)

Anyway, back to supplements. I do agree that a nutrition thread would be a great idea. 

I agree that elimination diets can probably be really useful. I am convinced that Ed and I need to do one, starting with the common, most popular, culprits, like dairy and gluten. 

But I have enough issues eating relatively healthy in general, and he's a chef, and we've just never gotten around to taking it seriously enough to do it. But we both have GI issues. His have been around forever and mine are fairly recent. It's getting to the point where we must do something about it. What? I don't know. It's so much fucking work just to eat healthy, not to mention eating around specialized dietary requirements. Ugh. Still, I will start a thread on nutrition and hope that people who know more than I do, and are interested in the subject, will come along to play...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Molly78

I think we need TerryK to do a literature search on hair testing......the evidence is out there somewhere.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Missykc

I take the route that I believe works for me. I don't take offense if someone else doesn't think my choice works. 

However I choose then I just have to make it a priority to take the darn supplements. 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Ne1
10 hours ago, Missykc said:

However I choose then I just have to make it a priority to take the darn supplements. 

Amen to that. Well, to both thoughts, really.

I swear I take more pills than my grandma did when she was in her 80s. Finally put all of 'em, even the supplements, in my bathroom cabinet so I remember to take them. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Felina

I just was going to buy some more l-tryptophan, and I ran across this deal on Amazon. I don't know how Amazon works for people outside the U.S., but this is an INSANELY good deal. Normally I spend $18-19 a month on this stuff. This is $1 a bottle! I don't know if it is a mistake or some sort of insanely good deal, so I thought I would share it before it goes away. I just spent $45 and it will buy me enough to last for years. Also, read the reviews: this is the best sleep aid I've ever found (and I've tried a lot of them).

http://www.amazon.com/BRI-Nutrition-L-Tryptophan-Servings-Tryptophan/dp/B00YBG6QE8?ie=UTF8&psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s00

*Edit: sale is over. I ended up buying a LOT of this stuff while it was $1/bottle!

 

Edited by Felina

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
phoenix

There is a lot of evidence in the sports performance world for the benefits of high dose Vit D, for that reason I do use it, I am however training very hard, at a high level and am more or less a 'professional dieter' in that my sport requires an extremely/dangerously low level of bodyfat, whilst training hard to hold muscle. If I wasn't I'm not sure I would, although there is one study which showed it either helped, or prevented breast cancer in women.

I've tried various sleep aids, especially in the latter stages of dieting when it is really difficult to sleep. Nothing works, so I stick to 'nighttime' herbal teas just in case there is some benefit (I drink various herb and fruit teas during the day so it's only an extension of what I'd do anyway).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Felina
2 hours ago, SKendall said:

I missed the sale!  Got 60 for $20.00.

If you like them, send me a PM - I bought so many bottles when they were $1 it isn't even funny. :)

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
phoenix

Whilst on the subject of supplements, thought I'd mention this. It's worth taking a look at the dosages and ingredients - many are full of fillers, shell is included in the weight, or concentrations are not high enough to be of benefit. If you're taking 6 capsules coating with that plasticky shell (it is glycerin or something?) then you are getting 6 lots of whatever it's coated in.

I recently decided to have a look at the ingredients of a 1000mg effervesant vitamin c tablet, it weighed about 5g which meant that 4g of it was sweetener and whatever else. 1000mg non-effervescent tablets weigh 2g, which means only 1g is filler/other ingredients. My husband and I have ditched the effervesant tabs.

 

For those in the US unfamiliar with metric weights, 1g = 1 gram = 1000mg (milligrams)...........

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Felina

I am returning to this thread to highly recommend another supplement. I had been taking B-complex vitamins orally (and they're disgusting) but I switched to these B-12 patches and they're AMAZING. Within a day my energy levels soared.  It's cleared the cobwebs out of my head too, and I feel fantastic. Read the reviews, this stuff is great!

http://www.vitasciences.com/B12patch

Edited by Felina
  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
SKendall

Thanks Felina, I never knew these even existed.  The reviews are great.  How long do they last?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Felina

@SKendall - You put a patch behind your ear for 24 hours once a week. I just started these last weekend and I'm still abuzz with happy energy. :)  The brain fog really lifted. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
time2quit

I wonder why they don't do a full B complex.  B-12 is great but all the b vitamins are really necessary especially thiamine.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
time2quit

So I guess I'd still take a high potency b-complex and add these to it....  Then again my multi is heavy in thiamine so these might be a nice adjunct to that.

Edited by time2quit
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Jetsman32

I am a big fan of supplements. I use the following:

Phenibut- absolutely awesome- only use it 2x per week- can be highly addictive but is great for anxiety. Generally when I'm on phenibut my confidence is through the roof. It also has great recreational value (almost like a safe drunk feeling). Do some research though before buying.

Passion Flower- awesome over the counter herb (vitaminshop or Amazon) for anxiety. It works well for me but I need to take double the dose

Valerian Root- great for sleep. Take 3 30 minutes before bed with melatonin and you will be out like a light

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Ne1

For lots of reasons we talked about on the other thread, I don't think of phenibut as a supplement, so much as a really powerful and highly addictive medication of sorts. I suppose I'm wrong about the medication part, but not the other stuff. Please use with caution!

I haven't been to this thread since the beginning of it. Sorry! Very cool about the B12, @Felina. I'm going to try it out. 

I'm posting today because my therapist gave me an article that is a composite of research done with folate (B9) and depression. The two are linked and for many people with alcoholism and/or depression, those are too low. A genetic test called MTHFR can tell whether or not you have a problem metabolizing B vitamins. I'm going to have it done at her insistence. I'm pretty sure it's covered by prescription if a doc prescribes. Will let you know if not. The article recommends 2g of folate, but that some people will only need 1g. And it needs to be taken with a high dose of B12 to be effective. I'm going to add it to the bucket of other supplements she has me taking. Actually, it's only 4, but between those and baclofen and 2 antidepressants, I feel like I have more meds than an 80 year old with a heart problem. Will report back, if I notice anything worthwhile. 

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1810582/

I can't remember if I put benfothiamine (vitamin B3) on here. It's been shown to reduce cravings and increase abstinence in people with alcoholism. 

And B12 and B6 have long been part of treatment for AL, that fell out of favor for some reason. Probably big pharma. Ha! (But seriously, probably!) 

So basically large amounts of B vitamins are a good choice for people with alcoholism. 

**Research:

The research about folate and B12 supplements is conflicting. Some say yes, (for depression treatment) http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15671130

Some say no, because it increases the serum levels but doesn't change homocysteine, which is the ultimate goal. Without a decrease in homocysteine, the vitamins are moot. I think. ( http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14696754 )

The trials used 0.07g, 0.08g, and 1g. Much less than the 2g the article suggests is needed for people with depression and/or alcoholism.

This study didn't show improvement in results for antidepressant potentiation (meaning the ADs didn't work better) but it only used .04g of folic acid and .001g of B12, so doesn't really correlate with the 'high dose' studies. And it wasn't a study directly related to analyzing depression or alcoholism. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20805005

I believe in the placebo effect, and anything that makes me feel better, even if all it does is make me think I feel better, usually makes me feel better. With some notable exceptions in the form of illegal drugs, which I never got into. But is beside the point. 

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Ne1

Also, @Nicnak I told her about the constipation and she recommended magnesium over the ducosate sodium I told you about. At least 250mg, in the pill form, not the gel kind, because the gel kind has artificial colors in it. :) She's nutty about artificial colors and is convinced that if I gave them up, I would suddenly be bionic. But artificial colors are in my favorite 'avoid craving by eating candy' protocol. So she's given up the cause. 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Jetsman32

Hi All,

    Phenibut is considered a nootropic and is defined as "(of a drug) used to enhance memory or other cognitive functions". Phenibut was developed by Russian Scientists for cosmonauts to take for anxiety. When used correctly (low dose 500m-1g) once or twice a week, Phenibut is great at helping you alleviate social anxiety completely. It also helps a person focus and enhances cognitive functions. It also helps promote sleep if used prior to bed. It also makes you feel just plain awesome. It's also nice that it's not considered a controlled substance and you can buy it online with ease. When used properly, Phenibut is great. The problem is that is very easy to abuse and tolerance builds quickly. I know that for me it became a crutch. Even though I work in HR I still struggle with speaking in front of large groups. I started using Phenibut for this reason and ended up liking it so much that it became daily and by the time I quit I was at 4-5g per day. Also, for anyone thinking about trying it- the withdrawals are insanely bad and it requires slow titration down to come off of it.

     If you are looking for a nootropic that really works and is non-habit forming then you should try Aniracetam. Aniracetam is also legal and helps to promote focus. I personally love it for work as it helps me to dial-in on my work and be much more effective and less distracted. The only thing you should know about this is that it is fat soluble meaning you should take it right after a meal for it to be most effective. I will usually take it after lunch with 3g of fish oil. This stuff really works and is definitely not addictive. I buy mine from Powdercity.com  

    I am known in my office as the herbal medicine man. For anxiety I recommend the following legal over the counter, not habit forming herbal supplements: Passion Flower, Valerian Root, Ashwaganda and L-theanine. All can also be used for sleep but of the ones I mentioned, Valerian Root is the best for helping with sleep. My personal favorite for anxiety is Passion Flower. Another thing that helps with anxiety is Chamomile tea. However, in order to get any real effects you should use at least 2 tea-bags per 8 ounce cup of very hot water and let it steep for 10 minutes before drinking. It is also great before bed and promotes sleep. I usually just fill a coffee cup with my Keurig with hot water and that does the trick.

    Some people are also big proponents of Kava-Kava. Personally I did not like the effects for anxiety. It makes you feel kind of weirdly drunk. It is also a bitch to prepare unless you buy instant. It is also very expensive. However, I know many drunks that have limited their alcohol intake buy switching to Kava Kava as they enjoy the feeling more. Also- Kava Kava is becoming very mainstream. There are Kava-Kava bars popping up all over the US. Little known fact but Kava Kava has been the drink of choice for Pacific Islanders for hundreds of year over alcohol. You may read some studies on line that say Kava is bad for your liver. This is only true if you buy Kava that is made from the leaves and not the root. If you want a quality Kava look for anything that is labeled as "Noble". This means it is only the root and has no adverse affects on the liver.

In terms of weight loss I highly recommend Garcinia Cambogia. This is a citrus fruit that grows in Asia.  Not only is it a powerful appetite suppressant but it also helps your body to stop converting carbohydrates into fat if taken 30 minutes prior to a meal.   It is also legal and safe and can be bought at any Vitamin Shoppe or online. You may have seen it promoted by Dr. Oz on TV. However, you can't just buy any Garcinia supplement and expect it to work. The main part of Garcinia that provides that promotes the weight loss benefits I mentioned above is HCA. So, if you are going to try to buy Garcina for weight loss you want to make sure it has a high percentage of HCA (at least 80%). The brand I buy on Amazon is great and is 95% HCA. I can tell you this really does work. Especially as an appetite suppressant. I do intermittent fasting usually for 23 hours between meals and this has been a life-saver. Here is the link:

https://www.amazon.com/Pure-Garcinia-Cambogia-Veggie-Capsules/dp/B0197XT7RC/ref=sr_1_1_s_it?s=hpc&ie=UTF8&qid=1469058701&sr=1-1&keywords=nutriflair+garcinia+cambogia

 

     

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Felina

Hi Jetsman,

Wow! That's some great info. I just ordered the Garcinia Cambogia. I had been eyeballing it for a while. I am pretty small but my weight does fluctuate wildly due to binge eating, a problem that long predates my alcoholism and I'm sure is tied into it.

Also interesting about the others. I am too scared to try phenibut, because I do have severe social anxiety and I am positive I'd become dependent. I have tried piracetam before it became impossible to obtain in the US, and I really liked it for baclofen memory fog. I have read about Fasoracetam recently (see the MWO thread) because it is specifically for baclofen memory issues.

Kava kava made my mouth numb but did nothing for my anxiety. I recently bought low dose beta blockers for stage fright on the advice of my sister. I just started a new job that involves public speaking and television appearances, both of which are terrifying for me. She said that the low dose beta blockers (5-10 mg of propranolol) completely eliminate the stage fright for her. I am going to try it - I used to be semi-addicted to Xanax and don't ever want to go through those withdrawals again.

 

 

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Felina

@joesixpack they definitely can be a huge evil.  When I was in active alcohoilsm and then recovery after rehab, I used xanax for anxiety. Man, the withdrawals from those things when I would run out was far, far worse than any anxiety I ever took them for in the first place. It was brutal! 

Also, welcome to the forum! :) I was a much more active contributor before I started this new job. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Jetsman32

Hey @Felina you are smart to stay away from Phenibut. it does it's job a little to well and is easy to become addicted to. Funny thing though, it has a very similar chemical structure to Baclofen. So when I started Baclofen I was able to titrate down my Phenibut over 10 days and have been Phenibut free for over a month now. I suffered no withdrawals whatsoever.

 I've read about Piracetam and have also read that Aniracetam works similarly but better overall. It also helps mildly with anxiety. You might want to get some Aniracetam and take it 30 minutes before you speak publicly and stack it with 2 Passion Flower tablets. I think you will notice a big difference. The one thing about Aniracetam that I've noticed is that the recommended dose of 750mg did not work for me. I had to take 4 times that amount to get the results I wanted. I'm sure you weigh less than me (201lbs) so start with 750 to see how it works. Again, I order this from Powdercity.com They have high quality nootropics that are pure.

Good call on the Garcina- did you order the one I recommended? If not, make sure the HCA level is at least 80%. When you take it, make sure to take it when you get hungry or are in between meals and also 30 minutes before each meal.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Felina
21 minutes ago, Jetsman32 said:

 I've read about Piracetam and have also read that Aniracetam works similarly but better overall. It also helps mildly with anxiety. You might want to get some Aniracetam and take it 30 minutes before you speak publicly and stack it with 2 Passion Flower tablets. I think you will notice a big difference. The one thing about Aniracetam that I've noticed is that the recommended dose of 750mg did not work for me. I had to take 4 times that amount to get the results I wanted. I'm sure you weigh less than me (201lbs) so start with 750 to see how it works. Again, I order this from Powdercity.com They have high quality nootropics that are pure.

Good call on the Garcina- did you order the one I recommended? If not, make sure the HCA level is at least 80%. When you take it, make sure to take it when you get hungry or are in between meals and also 30 minutes before each meal.

Thank you so much Jetsman! I will look into buying some Aniracetam and passion flower. I need all the help I can get once I have to start with the public speaking. I am a huge fan of nootropics/racetams based on my experience with piracetam, but the piracetam was later almost completely shut out of the U.S. while the others are still available. Go figure.

I did order the Garcina you linked! I take supplements pretty seriously :) and would rather go with one that is recommended. Thanks again!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Jetsman32

That is awesome! I hope they both work for you! I did a Baclofen experiment tonight on my thread titled "First day on Baclofen". I'd appreciate if you read it and comment with your thoughts.

Also- don't forget that Aniracetam is fat soluble. It won't work unless you eat prior to taking it. For me though, Fish Oil was the perfect fat substitute. If you are trying to avoid high fat foods then just take 3 1g Fish oil pills 20 minutes before you dose the Aniracetam and you will be just fine. Fish oil is also very good for you so this is a double plus anyway.

One you've tried it please message me and let me know your thoughts!

Also- here is the link for the Passion Flower I use. This is a pure Passion Flower extract that is concentrated. Although the recommendation is 1 pill at a time I have found that 2-3 are most effective for anxiety. Of course, start with one and if that doesn't work increase your dosage.

https://www.amazon.com/Passion-Supplement-Capsules-ANYWHERE-Sedative/dp/B007WSVM14/ref=sr_1_7_a_it?ie=UTF8&qid=1469071103&sr=8-7&keywords=passion+flower

Good luck and I can't wait to hear your results!

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
joesixpack

I've been hitting a bit of insomnia, tried a couple of NOW Passion Flower caps, some Kava tea, even some Gabapentin that my Sinclair Method doc prescribed for me back when I started that up (most of my days are AF now). My favorite used to be a couple of ibuprofen, that would usually take me right down, but that was when I was drinking 6-9 pints a day, then eating a half hour before I hit the sack. Nice little hypoglycemic backlash there to usher on unconsciousness...

Ended up using a pinch of a dried-up old gram of Cannatonic that I've had for a couple of years a couple of times, that finally seemed to do the trick, but doesn't make for the most clarity the next morning... 

I'm thinking that now my intestinal villi aren't entirely blown to kingdom come by booze, I should be able to ramp up the magnesium a bit more without getting the trots. 

Interesting info on the nootropics too, I'll have to look into that for anxiety/depression issues that malinger. Ah yes... all those nice things that helped fuel one's boozing, nicely preserved in alcohol and waiting.... 

That's ok, easier to deal with them with a clear head. Largely, I'm glad to be free of the stuff and if I do feel a bit down or edgy, alch doesn't even come up for a vote. Phew!

 

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Molly78

While we're on the topic of vitamin supplements (which we were on this thread a while back!) the British press is reporting today that most of us are low on vit D esp during the winter months. And now we live indoors crouched aver our laptops & smother ourselves with sunscreen, we are even likely to be deficient in the summer. Especially in the UK which has had a series of dreadful summers. Rickets is being seen again in toddlers, that was unheard of in the 1950s. Osteoporosis is a risk for older people with low levels of Vit D

Vit D also affects mood. Remember SAD (Seasonal Affective Disorder)? You could buy a UV lamp to mitigate the effects of winter!

I've been thinking about this because I have to take AdCal & aledronic acid because I am on steroids for polymyalgia rheumatica, & at my age the risk to bone age is considerable. I felt great, a real high, when I stated on all this treatment (partly because the crippling pain & stiffness disappeared within 24 hours), & although some of that is attributable to the steroids, I think I will go on taking a Vit D supplement even when I am over all this. Otherwise I have to eat 2 tins of tuna a day to get my required Vit D!

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
SKendall

Hi Molly, I live in the Pac Northwest and when my blood was tested I was seriously low.  This was about a year ago and my doctor explained 98% of the people in the world are deficient.  Sitting in the sun doesn't do it because we are covered in lotion with SPF.  She explained to me that if you live nr the equator and sunbathe naked w/o lotion then you're okay naked, really lol)

She initially started me on a therapeutic dose of 3,000 and it's now titrated down to 1200 daily.  After taking this for a few days I did feel a lot better.  I also have the UV lamp but not sure about the effects of that.  It's a lot more important than that eg.  bone and heart health.

Thank you for posting this.

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
SKendall

Felina, I also take the aricetam (sp) and adrinifil, both from powder city and need to find the passion flower.  I also take Phenibut occassionally if I need a good night's sleep, I take 300 mg. no more than 3 x a week.  Interesting benefit - pronounced sexual feeling.  Now, y'all are going to try it, lol.  I have never experienced any withdrawal issues, but remember to take it 3 hrs. before bed and have great sex!  ( No critics, a good romp is beneficial for anxiety also)  Responsibility is the key word for phenibut and the relaxing benefit lasts into the next day so you get 2 days benefit from 1 dose. 

Edited by SKendall
spelling
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
joesixpack

Good point about Vit D and technology. Thanks for bringing that up, Molly!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...