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Ne1

Ne's Progress Thread

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Ne1

I don't know if I should post this here or in the Share Your Story part, but I'll start it here. 

Let me say, first of all, that I have missed so much by not checking in this section of the forum. I'm really excited that there are so many threads I haven't read! I can't wait to read them. 

I'm going to start off with the fact that I'm really struggling with depression, in addition to the fact that I'm still drinking. The depression makes it almost impossible to communicate, the drinking is just...What it always is. Depressing. Makes me feel like a failure. Also makes me sick and tired. And I'm terribly tired of being sick and tired. But even when I don't drink, I still feel like shit. The drinking at least helps me pretend that what I'm doing (which is nothing, nada, zilch) is copacetic. Actually, what does my therapist call it? I forget. Disappearing from life or something like that, only better. Drinking is the great "opting out" of life, isn't it? 

I made a post yesterday on another thread about how I'm feeling, about the things my mind says to me, or that I allow myself to think about, that is indicative of depression...It's classic symptoms--hopelessness, regret, remorse, all that really negative stuff. I feel like an utter failure and that I am doomed. 

I'm planning on reposting that here, to start this thread off, so I know where I started and so other people can maybe understand why I'm not...me. I feel badly for not participating more here. It's my baby, after all. But that is just one more thing to feel shitty about.

Anyway. After my post yesterday I received a lot of really kind messages from people, and I really appreciate it. I know in my rational mind that Depression Lies and that things will get better. (I stole that line [Depression Lies] from this great blog, http://thebloggess.com/. It's worth a read, even if you don't have depression. She's very quirky and witty and fun.) 

So I'm going to repost that post from Stuck's thread here and I'll be back tomorrow morning first thing to catch up on all the groovy stuff I've missed and fill in more of what's going on with me. 

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Reggie

seeing the title of this thread brings back many memories 

lets hope its not stuck in the past 

great to see it though 

Love ya heaps Karen

Reg

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Ne1
23 hours ago, StuckinLA said:

I don't want to get better. I just want it all to be over, finally.

There, I said it. Nothing is going to get better, nothing is going to change. So what do we have left?

Why do I have to pull myself up out of this? It's so hard, and I have to be the one to drag myself out of this mess, for what? To help my students. To write a novel for other people. Fuck other people. I'm tired of it, too, Ne. I'm tired of thinking about other people. 

My response to Stuck's post was this: 

23 hours ago, Ne1 said:

I am right there with you. 

I said almost these exact same words to my husband on Sunday and my therapist on Monday:

Almost exactly those words. No exaggeration. When I woke up on Sunday morning, I was laying in bed petting the dog that drives me crazy, still, and realized that I have never in my life made a good decision. That all of my decisions have brought me to this place. I have no kids. I have always wanted kids. Always. My cousin just gave birth to her first child last week. I spent the day texting back and forth with her mother while they waited for the baby to be born. I cried for hours, feeling sorry for myself and sorry for my mother that I didn't give her any grandkids. Do you know how much my parents would have loved that? And ffs, if one more person that I tell that absolute secret to suggests I adopt or foster, I might fucking kill them with my bare hands. They're missing the point. That ship has sailed. It's done. No mulligans on life, baby.

Then there's the fact that I live in the suburbs. I fucking HATE the suburbs. I hate big yards. I hate quiet streets. I hate having neighbors who listen to fucking Rush Limbaugh or have a fucking Rebel flag hanging in their garage-cum-man cave. (Yes. Seriously. No exaggeration. He actually used the "N word" in front of me once! And shortly after we moved in, another neighbor told us that we were really lucky because when they replaced the roof on the house there weren't any Mexicans doing the job. They were all 'murricans. Thank holy hell for that. Not. Give me some latinos for friends and neighbors any fucking day over these people. Seriously.) (EDIT: I was the one who made the decision to purchase this house. Me. Not Ed. Not Ed and I together. Me. WTF was I thinking??? I was just too much stress and anxiety and I couldn't deal with it anymore so I just gave up and settled on this one. I will never forgive myself for that.) 

Add to it all that we were only going to be here for three years. But I turned getting an associates degree in nursing into an extra two years, with the accumulated debt to show for it. We're not going anywhere. Stuck in the 'burbs, baby. 

Plus, there's the debt. It's ridiculous. Totally unnecessary in retrospect. And the fact that I don't want to be a fucking nurse and never wanted to be one. Plan was to go straight through to PhD and then start treating my tribe the way we should be. Problem is, now I can't afford to go to school because of debt. And the fact that Ed got a DUI so we have to use the very little money we've got in the bank to pay for that instead of the classes I was going to take this summer so I could start my BSN program at UVA this fall. Not to mention that if it took me an extra year and a half to get an associates, imagine how long it would take to get a PhD???

Guess what? I'm looking at old age, with no savings, much less retirement, and no kids to look out for me. 

My entire family is a super-success story. Mom, Dad, brother, aunts, uncles...All extremely successful and productive alcoholics. Me? I was a fucking nanny for a decade. After private girls school education, six+ years in college, all paid for by my parents, and so many incredible chances to be happy and successful that it shames me to think about. 

What do I do now? Read fantasy novels. My husband and my parents are close to giving up on me and cutting me off. And I stopped taking my antidepressants 2 months ago because they were making me drink. It's going to be another 4-6 weeks until I feel better, and that's IF they actually fucking work. 

I literally told both my husband and my therapist that I wish I was suicidal. I WISH I had that chemical malfunction in my brain that convinces people to kill themselves. Because I don't see any point to the next 40 years. But I'm not. So that leaves me with one mother fucking option. Keep trying to get better before it gets so much worse. Or let it get worse until there isn't any place for me to live? Or what? I don't fucking know. But each mother fucking day is a new one and some days I do actually change out of pajamas and do something, anything, that makes that day better. 

So yeah, I get it. Whatever, dude. Do something. It's time to move on. 

 

 

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Ne1
15 minutes ago, time2quit said:

Yay Ne you did it!

Yay, I know! I figured how to start a thread, with a little bit of help from my friends! (So ridiculous that I forgot how to do it considering I started most of the threads on this forum, for goodness' sakes. Just shows you how kerfufffled I am at the moment. But getting better...)

9 minutes ago, Reggie said:

seeing the title of this thread brings back many memories 

lets hope its not stuck in the past 

great to see it though 

Love ya heaps Karen

Reg

Love you back, Reg. And no, let's not live in the past. As much as my mind takes me to the past and makes me relive all of the horrible things I think I've done and that the future feels pretty hopeless, I know that depression lies. 

And for sure, regardless of how bad things seem now, I'll never be as desperate or as hopeless about recovering from alcoholism as I was in 2010 when I started the first Progress Thread on MWO... Actually, it's a solid reminder of how far I've come and that things will never be that bad again. Ever. Now I know for sure that there's hope and that I can and will recover, again. 

Smooches atcha, Reg and everyone else. 

(http://www.mywayout.org/community/medication-research-and-support/42777-progress-thread-ne.html)

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DunDrinkn

Hi Ne. So happy to see you posting. I'm going to start my own thread too... soonish.

I am really hoping the memory loss thing I'm experiencing is related to drinking and not signs of early dementia. I forget how to do shit I just did last week. It is so sad...

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Ne1

Thanks, Dun. Good to see you here, too. And memory is one of those things that comes up when people quit drinking. It's part of the withdrawal and should get better with time. But goddamn, man. I do miss my 25 year old brain. Almost as much as I miss my 25 year old body. ha! 

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Ne1

I got a really great private message from a friend today. I hope she'll post the gist of it here, because it was important. (For those of you new to the forum, or who don't know me very well, I firmly believe that private messages and offline communication of any kind is sacrosanct and shouldn't be shared at all, ever. Just FYI. Anyway...)

So, rather than rehashing past events or posting my story, I'm just going to tell y'all where I am right now with drinking. 

I'm taking 300mg of baclofen. The last time I quit drinking (in Feb. 2011) I was taking 320mg. On most days I don't want to drink, and if I have even one beer, it makes me nauseous. Some days I ignore the nausea and try to get drunk anyway. Mostly it doesn't work. I can't drink enough. On those days it's very frustrating that I don't HAVE to drink, but still WANT to drink. I mean, what the hell is wrong with me? The whole point of taking this medication, the whole point of this forum, the whole point of the goals in my life, all of those things are related to not drinking. It must seem incredibly hypocritical to the people who don't know me well or know about how baclofen works. (And frankly, even the ones that do know me well and know about baclofen.) 

Then there are the days when I binge and actually get drunk. I think the last time was the Tuesday night before my exam. Which was on May 18th, so 9 days ago. Or no, actually, maybe I got drunk again on Monday. Anyway. It's very disconcerting, as you might imagine. I have a beer, and then a second, and they feel and taste good, and then I'm 12 (or more) in and wake up the next morning feeling like I'm the worst ever and wondering what went wrong. Well, I picked up the first beer, and then the second... That's obvious. But why is it that on some days, I simply can't drink and on other days the compulsion is so strong that I can override that and drink to oblivion? I don't know. 

There's more, but it's 10am here and I've been committing myself to do productive, physically active things, every day. It's time for me to bike and walk with the dog. I'll be back later. 

 

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SKendall

I was the one who pm'd Ne. She has asked me to post my issues here.

I subscribed financially and expected a lot more than I've been getting regarding living happily in sobriety and helping newcomers.

I am very frustrated with Both Ne and Stuck and not because they are drinking, but because THEY DON'T WANT TO GET SOBER.  Sobriety doesn't fall into your lap while you are sitting on the couch feeling sorry for yourself or vomiting in your bed.

Stuck, if I were paying for a drunk to teach my kids with MY hard-earned money, I would be pissed and you also claim self-pity.

Ne, I take your posts with a grain of salt b/c I don't know if you've been drinking.

Self-pity is one of those emotions that are fucking useless and never attractive, I was raised by stiff upper lip English parents, so it was never accepted.  Self-pity denotes laziness and an unwillingness to help oneself.

Why do you post when you're not looking for sobriety?  Ne, I look at your post the other day where you are in debt, never passed your expensive school certificates, and wished you'd gone for a higher degree?  Really?

Sobriety and life management takes work and neither of you are willing to do that so you continue to drink and don't function in any positive way.

 

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Molly78
25 minutes ago, SKendall said:

I was the one who pm'd Ne. She has asked me to post my issues here.

I subscribed financially and expected a lot more than I've been getting regarding living happily in sobriety and helping newcomers.

I am very frustrated with Both Ne and Stuck and not because they are drinking, but because THEY DON'T WANT TO GET SOBER.  Sobriety doesn't fall into your lap while you are sitting on the couch feeling sorry for yourself or vomiting in your bed.

 

Yup. I'm with you there, SKendall. I would also like to hear more from people living happily in sobriety. 

I follow posts from Ne & Stuck, sympathise, but feel that newcomers will be put off by their apparent inability to get their act together.  While enthusing about baclofen, their stories will hardly encourage someone starting out on a journey towards sobriety. I mean the message that comes over is "baclofen is wonderful, but look where I am now....".

OTOH, most people living happily in sobriety might not want to spend a lot of time posting on this website. And if they do, their posts will be relatively short. It's encouraging to read posts from Baclofenman, Bleep, terryk, Cassander & others whose names I can't bring to mind, perhaps because they don't post often....... I just had a look at the  list of members, & there are lots who have never posted at all.

Personally, I have been sober but not abstinent for 2 1/2 years. There are times I struggle, so I like to feel I am part of a community of people like me who I can touch base with. But there don't seem to be many like me on here  at the moment.

Having said all that, I am eternally grateful to Ne for starting this site. And I don't want to sound critical - I know what a struggle it is.

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Ne1
1 hour ago, SKendall said:

I was the one who pm'd Ne. She has asked me to post my issues here.

I subscribed financially and expected a lot more than I've been getting regarding living happily in sobriety and helping newcomers.

I am very frustrated with Both Ne and Stuck and not because they are drinking, but because THEY DON'T WANT TO GET SOBER.  Sobriety doesn't fall into your lap while you are sitting on the couch feeling sorry for yourself or vomiting in your bed.

Stuck, if I were paying for a drunk to teach my kids with MY hard-earned money, I would be pissed and you also claim self-pity.

Ne, I take your posts with a grain of salt b/c I don't know if you've been drinking.

Self-pity is one of those emotions that are fucking useless and never attractive, I was raised by stiff upper lip English parents, so it was never accepted.  Self-pity denotes laziness and an unwillingness to help oneself.

Why do you post when you're not looking for sobriety?  Ne, I look at your post the other day where you are in debt, never passed your expensive school certificates, and wished you'd gone for a higher degree?  Really?

Sobriety and life management takes work and neither of you are willing to do that so you continue to drink and don't function in any positive way.

 

Thanks so much for sending me a message about this instead of just leaving, SKendall. And I really appreciate you posting here, too. I am actually in the midst of yard-stuff and took a break to cool down, drink some water, and check in here. I will respond more fully tomorrow morning. 

Same with your post, Molly. 

11 minutes ago, Molly78 said:

Yup. I'm with you there, SKendall. I would also like to hear more from people living happily in sobriety. 

I follow posts from Ne & Stuck, sympathise, but feel that newcomers will be put off by their apparent inability to get their act together.  While enthusing about baclofen, their stories will hardly encourage someone starting out on a journey towards sobriety. I mean the message that comes over is "baclofen is wonderful, but look where I am now....".

OTOH, most people living happily in sobriety might not want to spend a lot of time posting on this website. And if they do, their posts will be relatively short. It's encouraging to read posts from Baclofenman, Bleep, terryk, Cassander & others whose names I can't bring to mind, perhaps because they don't post often....... I just had a look at the  list of members, & there are lots who have never posted at all.

Personally, I have been sober but not abstinent for 2 1/2 years. There are times I struggle, so I like to feel I am part of a community of people like me who I can touch base with. But there don't seem to be many like me on here  at the moment.

Having said all that, I am eternally grateful to Ne for starting this site. And I don't want to sound critical - I know what a struggle it is.

 

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DunDrinkn

Chiming in here at 12 days AF. Not struggling right now, but I have and will again probably. I have (I think) decided for myself that I have to be abstinent. I have slipped out of sobriety too many times in the last 4 years when I lower my dosage and then drink. I really want to lower my dosage because of side effects. And I also don't see the point in drinking a few beers, or whatever now and then. I'm not someone who wants to social drink. When I want to drink it's to get loaded.

I know that many of us (myself included) have touted on MWO that baclofen enables us to not have to worry or be vigilant about staying AF. I am slowly and painfully coming to the conclusion that for me this isn't true. I am just really glad SF isn't on this board, or frankly I might never admit this even to myself. I hate that self-righteous SOB.

Flexing the muscle to not drink is heavy lifting. At least for a while. Even on baclofen. It is effortless in some ways (yes, I'm contradicting myself, I know). Ne speaks to this beautifully -- not wanted to drink, yet still having to battle not to drink. With each day that passes since I've had a drink, there is more daylight. It gets easier. And I'll stay up here in terms of dosage for a while. But I don't think I'm going to "test the waters" anymore. I always think I'm just dipping my toe in, but up comes the Loch Ness Monster that grabs my foot and drags me down into the murky depths.

I like what SKendall said about changing the things that make us want to drink. The good news about baclofen is that it does create the brain space to be able to slowly start to dig out. Much faster than trying to quit without chemical intervention. I've been doing some hard work on my life, my relationship in particular. And that's my trigger. When I don't feel engaged in my intimate relationship, I want to drink to check out. I am looking for other places to engage (actually I'm just thinking about it) because that's too much pressure, and an unrealistic burden for one person.

I do not want Stuck or Ne or anyone else who is having a difficult time sorting it out and finding the motivation to stop drinking to stop posting. I get that it is frustrating to watch someone wallow in their shit (or vomit) and not be able to see the "writing on the wall". So telling them to cut it the fuck out, is fine. But I want to be careful about shutting down honest sharing -- even if it doesn't put the best face on a meds site. It's real. That's why we continue to read Ne's and Stuck's posts even though they scare us or piss us off. Getting sober IS so much more than taking a pill. And supporting each other is about telling the truth, but also holding space for everyone who suffers, regardless of where they are in the process.

It is sometimes hard for me to read posts by people still drinking. Sometimes it makes me want to drink. Sometimes it makes me angry. But you know what, it also tells me I don't want to go there again. The members on this site who are suffering the most are the ones that are going to post the most (I hope). Because when they go silent, that's when I really worry. STUCK... WHERE ARE?

 

 

Edited by DunDrinkn
grammar, more grammar
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StuckinLA

SK, Molly, Dun, your replies and your honesty are both appreciated. And don't think I'm not listening - your points are well taken.

Blah blah today is day 2, I went to a meeting last night and a meeting this morning blah blah. Sounds like so many more empty promises by now. But I do want to be sober today. And I have a meeting planned in the morning for right before canvassing for Bernie again.

Meds may not be my route - I don't want to do baclofen again. The SEs, and I just don't have it in me to titrate up at the moment. I may look into other medication routes (gabapentin) later in the summer when I know what my financial (and insurance) situation will be.

Anyway, hope it's a good one out there for everybody.

Edited by StuckinLA
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SKendall

Dun, that was a great and very honest post.  I can totally relate to wanting to check out and I think that's what normal people who drink do.  I am mad that I can't do it!

I would very much like this forum to be a help for newcomer's and in it's present state it cannot.  Dun, I am also with you on being honest.  My first reaction was to stop posting and just go away, but I had an emotional investment in MWO and I had hoped to have one here.  I would like to get to know more members.

I don't want to minimize postings or honesty at all.  When we remain active in our disease we don't see what ELSE is going on and don't emotionally mature at all.

Ne, you mentioned that I had posted in hidden msgs, that was unintentional, b/c I don't know how to do that, lol.

Edited by SKendall
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Ne1

Morning, everyone. Thanks for your posts. I know I said I would post a response today, but I can't. Ed's off and we have a lot to do around the house together. Plus, he (understandably) resents the time I spend on the computer. In addition to that, I start a review program for my certification exam today at 11am and it runs until 6:30. Ditto tomorrow. 

I am listening and looking forward to reading more and responding. And I REALLY appreciate your posts. 

Congrats, Stuck, on day 2! And on going to the meetings. Very proud of you. And happy for you. 

I'll be back again as soon as I can. 

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Molly78

Hi everyone from sunny Lanzarote where I am on holiday with 2 oldest grandchildren aged 9 & 11. We are all inclusive which works well for them but is a challenge for me - free alcohol on tap (literally) all day. Taking the bac at usual dose. Finding  it difficult not to stock up on alcoholic beverages - a whole line up of various liquers at the bar.

Dark choc ice cream is to die for. Another challenge to my increasing waistline due to steroids.

Im thinking of it as a holiday. One week. back to normal next Monday. Fingers crossed.

I just wanted to check in here for the responses to SKendalls post, but doubt if I can keep postin all week - 2 earos for 10 mins - about to run out of time....

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Felina

Sounds lovely, @Molly78! Enjoy your trip. You can always bump up 20-30 mgs if you're feeling overwhelmed by all the free drinks.

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Ne1

I don't have time to respond until tomorrow (Monday) morning, Eastern Standard Time, Molly. 

Hope you're having fun! Thanks for checking in. 

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SKendall

Ne, you are in a bad place and I'm very sorry.  I have no answers but to try and heal.  I have been where you are and it was awful.

Take care.

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Mom2JTx3

I'm glad to have found this thread.  Dun, I think I may be with you on the AF part.  For over four months I was happily indifferent.  I could enjoy a couple of drinks, and it wasn't a problem.  Then I hit a rough patch and went back to my crutch.  I should have started to titrate up on Bac again right away, but I was enjoying the liquid courage and ended up totally screwing myself.  I don't think I will risk it again, and I really can't now anyway.

Stuck, you should look into the Sinclair method using Naltrexone.  It seems a certain group of people do very well on it.  If I had it to do all over again, I would have tried it first.

I've always been concerned that the checking in thread is so front and center on this forum.  I know when people from MWO first visited over here, there was conversations about the only postings were from people taking Baclofen and drinking.  That's when it looked like there were only a few topics in gd.  The arrangement is better now, but it's still the first thread you see here and as a newbie visiting, it's not the correct introduction to our site.  I think we may want to think about where to place that to refocus the newbie experience.

Ne, I'm so sorry you're struggling.  I know things will get better, it just takes so damn long.  Effexor saved my dh's life.  He couldn't cope at all several months ago and he is completely back to normal.  Thankfully he doesn't drink on it. My fervent wish is for you to find some relief.

Mom2

Edited by Mom2JTx3
Clarification on gd thread arrangement
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Mom2JTx3

I woke up this morning thinking how offensive that check in / Baclofen and drinking comment sounded when lots of us are just trying to get through to the other side.  I apologize.  You know I've done the same, and I started a whole thread about it as well.  Anyway, my concern about the newbies stands.  How do we support each other but put success front and center?  Maybe the first section should be the research?   

Thanks,

Mom2

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Ne1

I don't want to quote every single post that I want to respond to, because it'll just take to long and be too long to read. I mean it sincerely when I say that I am very grateful for your posts, SK, Molly, Dun and Mom. This kind of discussion is vital to giving legitimate support to people, and for keeping this forum legitimate. 

First of all, ouch. Those were some hard words to read. I asked SKendall to post her message to me about her frustration publicly because I know other people feel the same way and don't want to address it, and also because I agree with a lot of what she had to say and wanted to respond here.

I want you all to know that I never post when I'm drunk. I very rarely get drunk, but even if I do, I wouldn't post. Don't get me wrong, when I first started at MWO, I was drunk-posting all the time. Probably for the first year. But I'm way past that point now. My life doesn't revolve around getting drunk, like it used to back then. I also feel a responsibility to keep my posts legitimate and don't want to undermine my credibility by posting drunk, especially when it happens so rarely. No reason to share it here, for sure. It's hard enough to admit after the fact. (Which is not to say that I think people have to be sober to post. On the contrary. I don't ever want this place to exclude the people in active alcoholism. My purpose in life is to help them, not shun them.) Plus, it's just been really difficult for me to reach out to anyone in anyway. Especially here, which is my beloved and I feel very ashamed about all that stuff you pointed out, SKendall et. al. 

Self-pity is pathetic. It's worthless. I know this. So are regret and remorse. But can you understand that these are the things that my mind goes to automatically when I'm depressed? I don't decide to wallow in self-pity or regret. I wake up with it. It's the default thinking in my mind right now. When it happens, I try to stop it as soon as I realize I'm doing it and think about something else. Usually that means I pick up my book and escape into that instead of dealing with those feelings that aren't any good anyway. And when I do think about them, and try to "stay in the moment" and manage them, I am filled with self-loathing and hopelessness about what the future holds. I'm not making excuses, or at least I hope you don't see it that way. I'm just trying to explain. I know, too, more than everything else, that where I am and how I feel and what I do are up to me, and only me. 

But to say that I'm not trying, or that I don't want to be sober, isn't fair. I wouldn't be taking baclofen if I didn't want to be sober. I wouldn't be on this forum if that wasn't my primary goal. However, you're right in that it's the wrong decision to continue to drink--to give myself the option to drink--when I don't HAVE to drink. Because I don't think I HAVE to drink anymore. I talked to Ed this weekend about picking a date when we decide to abstain and not have any booze in the house at all. If it's here, I'll try it, even if I don't want it. Unfortunately, he's not taking enough baclofen, and I think it will be much harder for him. But we both agreed that the years when we were sober (not abstinent) and didn't keep booze (except wine for special occasions) in the house and drank only rarely, were pretty amazing. We certainly wouldn't be where we are now if we hadn't started drinking again. Hell, it wasn't so long ago that we would buy beer for guests when we were having company and whatever was left would go bad...It's hard to remember what that was like, just as hard as it is to remember now what it's like to not care about alcohol. 

And as far as the depression is concerned, well, your comments make me really defensive, and I don't want to be defensive about any of this. Stiff-upper-lip is not applicable. It's an illness as much as alcoholism is an illness. And dammit, I'm trying every single day to make sure that I'm not just sitting on the couch every day and doing nothing to help recover from it. I haven't posted about it, because I haven't been posting. But I will post about it, because now I'm posting. I also know, and have heard from several people, that it isn't cool that I stopped posting. I apologize. I know it's important and I love it here and I want it to succeed. It was really irresponsible to walk away, even for a while. 

I KNOW that all of these things aren't just a matter of taking the pills and waiting for the miracle. Though that is how it works, in a way, too. To have the choice means being able to make other, better choices, but that doesn't mean it's easy. I know you guys get that.

As far as being attractive to newcomers, and the lack of people posting about contented sobriety, well...Hmmmm. The people who clicked the thank you button for your post, and yourselves included, SKendall, and Molly, are all contentedly sober and are not posting about it. Unless I'm missing something? Which might be, because as you know, I missed a lot for those weeks that I wasn't paying attention regularly. I also know that several people who are contentedly sober/abstinent are really damn busy. That's what happens when you get sober. Life starts. But still, I can't pretend I'm sober, I won't lie about my struggle, I won't pretend it isn't hard and that I am making shitty decisions on some days, or not following through on the goals I set for myself. Even if that makes people think that baclofen doesn't work, or that this forum isn't a good one. What I write is the truth as I see it. Now, don't get me wrong, I don't mind (and really appreciate) when people call me out on my bullshit, just like you did here. But if I gloss over the truth, because I'm scared of judgment or ashamed, it's bad for me and for the forum. Secrets kill us just as much as the booze does. 

If newbies can't relate, then they're not like me. Or him. But there will be others who come along who will start posting who aren't like us, and they'll need help from those of you who aren't like us. Many of you have experiences just like ours, but more of you don't. Make sure you're here to welcome them and reach out with support. It takes a village. 

From my experience, and after reading the meds threads pretty much daily (and other areas, too) of MWO for 6+ years, I know for a fact that what I'm experiencing; the setbacks, the regret/remorse/self-pity, even the hopelessness and despair, are part of the experience of getting sober. And with baclofen, it used to be that it was okay to acknowledge that the drinking was dwindling, without passing judgment about the fact that the person was still drinking. That may be in the past, but it is still relevant to how I perceive my own drinking right now. It's a matter of going...going...gone... But I hear that you are more than ready for me to stop drinking, and you're right. It IS a decision, after all. And while most days, I drink less than 3 beers, I'm still drinking and I definitely still want to get drunk. (I have made the decision to abstain from liquor, and wine, though. Because I CAN get drunk if I drink those, and I really am focused on trying to be contentedly sober, people. Really.) 

I know, too, that what people share when they're drunk or don't seem to be trying, even the stuff that makes me crazy, is what many, many, many of us experience when we start this process. Drunk-a-logs aren't allowed in AA, and I'm not sure it's kosher to write posts about getting drunk and posting while drunk about being drunk. But that ain't up to me. And I know just what that's like, because I've been there. Half the time I want to join in the drinking to oblivion, and the other half my impulse to "save" people kicks in. Baclofen makes it impossible for me to wander down that road to total escapism, denial and self-delusion. (Therapy helps with that, too. She's not going to let me get away with not taking responsibility for my own part in life.) And whether or not someone chooses to do anything about changing. All I can do is what I do. Encourage someone to get some help. Give the occasional dose of reality. Just like the fact that you've given me one, here. 

Which, by the way, comes on the heels of my parents and my husband saying just what you've said. Even my therapist is like, "Ok, come on...Time to get this ball rolling." 

About the forum: we're two months old. I'm actually surprised about how much activity there is here, and how many members we have, honestly. When Lo0p started his forum, it was eerily silent and stayed that way. (For the record, the vast majority of members on these kind of forums don't post. And definitely don't post regularly, when they do post.) 

I'm really sorry that it hasn't lived up to expectations. I take the responsibility for that, and will work harder and better to both get myself well and make sure this place stays relevant and on topic.

Thank you SKendall, so much for your support. I know that it is a financial burden for you right now, and am humbled that you continue to donate when I know it's tough. As far as I know, you're still the only monthly forum subscriber! That will have to change over the next couple of months, if we're going to stay viable and get ourselves listed on a google search. But I think the first steps are to figure out how best to present the forum. And honestly, I want to be contentedly sober before that happens. There are a lot of contacts out there, people who share our goals and may want to participate or support us, and I can't reach out to them if I'm still depressed/miserable/drinking. 

Finally, I'm not really ready to have a discussion about the abstinence vs. drinking occasionally conundrum while taking baclofen or other meds. At least not for me, right now. I think the conversation is an important one, though. I'm just not in that place yet. I'm very clear I want some significant abstinence time before I have a drink, if ever. Life was so much infinitely better when we didn't drink. The times that we did drink weren't that special. I mean, it's not like we set up a certain occasion to "let" ourselves drink. And we definitely didn't plan days for it, and didn't look for excuses to do it, nor did we drink at home, unless we had company. But that's moot right now. Now I recall those days with yearning and talk about regret! Going down too low on baclofen and starting the antidepressant that has been shown to increase craving and withdrawal was a HUGE mistake and will never happen again. There is also the fact, as Dun and Mom said, that the risks outweigh the rewards. We were happily indifferent for almost 4 years, and drank only occasionally. But the last 18 months of drinking have been hell. If I had committed to complete abstinence, then I never would have found myself increasingly drinking more and more. Or if I had, I would've freaked out about it sooner. Maybe. Who knows? Hindsight and all that...Relapse is part of the definition of this disease. It literally defines it. I just wish I wasn't the living proof of it. It has made me much more sympathetic/empathetic for people who just can't seem to get it together, or take an extra long time to get better. 

I wonder, bleep, how it is that you can go back and forth from abstinence/no baclofen to drinking and then back to baclofen/abstinence so easily. At least it seems like it has been easy, based on what I've read so far. 

Sorry for the wall of words. Lots to respond to. 

Thank you again, for posting your thoughts and offering your support. I'll be back tomorrow. And the next day and the next...

 :75_EmoticonsHDcom:

 

 

 

 

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DunDrinkn

I could do a (smallish) monthly donation but can't figure out how to do that. Can someone let me know?

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Ne1

It's in the bottom right of the forum, Dun. Thanks, sister. 

Also, Mom, I didn't think your comments were negative. I appreciate the feedback. We'll keep working on it. 

 

Screen Shot 2016-05-30 at 12.31.12 PM.png

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Admin1
2 hours ago, Ne1 said:

 As far as I know, you're still the only monthly forum subscriber!

There are currently two monthly subscribers Ne, including Sk.

 

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Ne1

Thanks, Admin1. I realized that I really shouldn't be commenting on that sort of thing, anyway. Huge apologies to the other subscriber and an even bigger THANK YOU so much to both of you. Hopefully others will join in, and we can achieve some of the other goals we came up with when we started this forum. 

So, I've read and reread these posts over the last 24 hours, and I have written and deleted many things to add to my responses here and on Stuck's thread, but I really just can't do it. I find myself becoming more and more angry. And I don't want to lash out and I definitely don't want to be defensive, so I'm just going to ignore it for the time being, until I feel a little less...insulted. Because I am assuming that was not the intent. And I really appreciate honest feedback. It is extremely important to me to be held accountable, and to have other people point it out when I'm not being honest or straightforward with myself. But I just can't help but feel like some of the statements in those posts were really unfair. 

I guess that's all I'm going to say about that for now. I'll be back tomorrow, I suppose, with more of what's going on with me. Or not. I don't know, actually. But I'll definitely be back tomorrow, somewhere around here.

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Lostinspace

Ne - I only just discovered this thread yesterday, when I didn’t leave myself enough time to post before I had to leave. D’oh! I really do need to check the general discussion section more often - obviously! Anyway, I’m way late to this party. I’ll just say that I’m so sorry you’re still struggling so much with depression and I hope the drinking continues to slowly abate for you, at least until you and Ed reach the date that you decide you’re going to be abstinent together. Everything will be alright eventually, it just takes time. Hang in there.

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Molly78

Ne, I will be making a financial contribution when I get home fromLanzarote. I´m afraid I didn´t do it at the beginning because I didn´t have faith that it would get off the gound - sorry!

Not sure what you mean about Google - I had to Google the forum here to find it, & it came up a little way down the list after Ameisen´s book. so I don´think you have to pay to get listed on Google.

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Admin1
On 01/06/2016 at 6:53 PM, Molly78 said:

Not sure what you mean about Google - I had to Google the forum here to find it, & it came up a little way down the list after Ameisen´s book. so I don´think you have to pay to get listed on Google.

Evening Molly

The Googlebots crawl our pages so we get a listing on the search engine. The more visits we get from a google search the higher up the listings we go. However as this is free it is always a waiting game. Although we have some meta tags in place with a name like The End Of My Addiction our "target" the market is rather limited. Currently about 25% of our traffic is Google generated so there is room for improvement.

Improvement is in the form of a wait and see game or a financial investment in SEO which will cost around $150 US a month, which is obviously a non-starter. I have also looked into pay for click, which can be horribly expensive or very wasteful.

I am always open to marketing suggestions

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time2quit
On May 30, 2016 at 0:36 PM, Admin1 said:

There are currently two monthly subscribers Ne, including Sk.

 

it seems more than that  Bacman comes to mind.  I plan on helping as well.  wish there was an option for a single donation.

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